New book from NYT bestselling author Lewis Howes is now available!

New book from NYT bestselling author Lewis Howes is now available!


Marianne Williamson

Running for President and Standing for Love


Most of us know the parable of The Good Samaritan.

It tells the story of an injured man at the side of the road.

The priest crosses to the other side and ignores the man in need of help.

The Levite does the same. 

The Samaritan, though, stops and cares for the man.

But let’s zoom out a bit.

Is there something we could do on a more global scale so that less men are left injured and uncared for on the side of the road?

People are living with chronic trauma. Every day is a struggle. If there is a way to help more people at once, we should be open to making those changes.

On today’s episode of The School of Greatness, I talk about caring for those who are in need with a 2020 candidate for President of the United States: Marianne Williamson.

“Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure.” @MarWilliamson  

Marianne Williamson is an internationally acclaimed lecturer, activist and author of four #1 New York Times bestselling books. She has been a popular guest on television programs such as Oprah, Good Morning America, and Bill Maher. In 1989, she founded Project Angel Food, a meals-on-wheels program that serves homebound people with AIDS in the Los Angeles area. To date, Project Angel Food has served over 11 million meals. Marianne also co-founded the Peace Alliance.

Marianne is seeking to harness the power of love to fight the hate she sees in the world. She teaches us to go “all in” for the causes we believe in while being unattached to the result.

So get ready to learn how to overcome the fear of failure and change the world on Episode 838.

“If Hate is shouting, Love cannot afford to whisper.” @MarWilliamson  

Some Questions I Ask:

  • Why are people suffering more now? (8:00)
  • How do we teach people to pick themselves up? (17:00)
  • What is the root of emotional disconnection right now? (20:00)
  • What made you want to run for president? (30:00)
  • Is a woman better-suited to be president alone than with a partner? (41:00)
  • What’s your greatest fear? (46:00)
  • How do you train your heart to face the day each morning? (52:00)
  • What would you say in a final debate? (59:00)

In this episode, you will learn:

  • About Marianne’s philosophy of “The Conscious Samaritan” (10:00)
  • Why “trickle-down economics” doesn’t work (18:30)
  • Why people should keep up with the news (27:00)
  • The importance of failure (30:30)
  • The difficulties in having a partnership when you’re a career-focused woman (40:00)
  • The reason people attack you when you challenge the status quo (50:00)
  • Plus much more…
Connect with
Marianne Williamson

Transcript of this Episode

LEWIS HOWES: This is episode 838 with the #1 New York Times bestselling author currently running for the Democratic bid for president, Marianne Williamson.


LEWIS HOWES: Welcome to the School of Greatness. My name is Lewis Howes, former pro athlete turned lifestyle entrepreneur. Each week, we bring you an inspiring person or message to help you discover how to unlock your inner greatness. Thanks for spending some time with me today, now let the class begin.


LEWIS HOWES: Oprah Winfrey said, “Your greatest power is to show love, to receive love, and to be loved.” And Albert Einstein said, “Peace cannot be kept by force, it can only be achieved by understanding.” Love and understanding is something that we can all use a little bit more of. It could support us in our inner peace, and as well as humanity’s peace. Today, we’ve got Marianne Williamson, internationally-acclaimed lecturer, activist, and author of four #1 New York Times bestselling books. She’s been one of America’s most well-known public voices for more than three decades and has counseled many leaders in a variety of industries ranging from business, to culture, to politics. 7 of her 12 books have become New York Times bestsellers.

She founded Project Angel Food, a meals on wheels program that serves homebound people with AIDS in the Los Angeles area, as well as co-founded Peace Alliance. She’s been a popular guest on TV like Oprah and Good Morning America, and again, is currently running for the Democratic bid for president. 

In this interview, we talked about how public policy should uncap people’s dreams and not limit them. The source of emotional disconnection for most people and how to find that source. You start tapping into it for good. The power of inner work when you are facing daily trauma. What to be ready for if you live a meaningful life. And how to fail well. How to train yourself for love every day, and so much more. Also Marianne shares some of her biggest wishes and biggest fears as well leading into this campaign.

And if you enjoy this interview, if you feel like it’s brought you inspiration, you’ve learned something from it, please share it with one friend today. Send them the link to this episode on Apple Podcast or Spotify or wherever you’re listening to podcasts. Or you can just text them the link: lewis and send it to one person today you think would find this fascinating, inspiring, and helpful.

And before we dive into this interview, big thank you to our sponsor today. Quartz. Now Quartz is creative, intelligent journalism, rich with culture, and broad world views. With more than 230 people around the world collaborating to bring a global perspective, Quartz has a presence all over the world. [Contains?] coverage of the global economy with topics and questions of importance to business professionals. A Quartz membership provides a community for the new generation of global business leaders. So if you want to become more of a global business leader and understand things, then make sure to check out Quartz. You get access to all of Quartz’s award-winning journalism with the ability to dial into the newsroom during conference calls for a behind-the-scenes look, invites to in-person Quartz events, in-depth field guides to the most destructive forces in business, and other member-exclusive journalism. No paywalls ever. 

Make sure to check this stuff out because Quartz is offering you guys 25% off your first year of membership. Just go to and enter my code “GREATNESS” at checkout. You can check it out right now, that’s with promo code “GREATNESS” for 25% off your first year of membership. Check it out right now at promo code “GREATNESS.” Again, exclusives insights to breaking world news and narratives, perfect for tomorrow’s top business leaders. Make sure to check it out at, promo code: “GREATNESS.”

And big thank you to Talkspace. Now Talkspace believes that no student should have to wait to get the support they need. With the Talkspace Student Plan, students can connect with their therapists in less than 24 hours. They’ll choose from a selection of recommended therapists and get started right away. So there’s no more waiting for this. If their first therapist isn’t the right fit, they can always switch therapists at no extra cost. The challenge is the price for traditional therapy makes it really hard for students to use that. And a whole month of Talkspace Student Plan costs about as much as a single face-to-face therapy session. So it’s amazing savings. You never want to wait to talk about something that [you’re in breakdown?]. You always need to get it out. The quicker you get it out, the better. That’s the thing I love about Talkspace is you can really share the things you’re struggling with with someone who is a licensed therapist. Now the Talkspace Student Plan pairs your student with a licensed therapist trained to address the challenges they face. To get started for a fraction of the price of traditional therapy, go to Make sure to use my code “GREATNESS” to get your first week free and show your support for this show. Again go to, use the promo code “GREATNESS” at 

Big thank you to our sponsors Quartz and Talkspace. Again, make sure to check them both out to support your life.

And now let’s dive in. I’m super excited about this. Incredible insights in this interview. Make sure to let me know what you think over at Instagram @lewishowes and Marianne Williamson as well. Without further ado, the one and only, Marianne Williamson.


LEWIS HOWES: Welcome everyone back to the School of Greatness podcast. We’ve got the iconic Marianne Williamson in the house. Thank you for being here.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Thank you babe for having me.

LEWIS HOWES: Yes. I think we’ve only been around each other four times that I can remember. One time was I did an introduction I think four years ago when you were doing Congress touring in California, and then I had you on my podcast three years ago, and that blew up online and people loved that. 


LEWIS HOWES: Maybe one at a time, I can’t remember, but maybe this was only the third time. But I really feel like we’ve connected in a beautiful way.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Yeah, there’s a recognition. 

LEWIS HOWES: You have an amazing soul and an amazing heart. And I’m just very grateful for your leadership, for your inspiration. You’ve paved the way for so many people like myself to do what I do. It’s inspiring that you are—like 12 or 13 books?


LEWIS HOWES: Many books. 


LEWIS HOWES: 14, who knows. A number of them on the New York Times bestseller list. You just had your birthday. Can we say how old you are?


LEWIS HOWES: 67. You’re just young, I love it. Wise. And you’re running for the presidential campaign.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Democratic nomination for the presidency.

LEWIS HOWES: It’s amazing. At 67, you continue to inspire us, you continue to live your message and your truth, and I think it’s a really cool example that you set. I just want to acknowledge you, first off, of that. 

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: I appreciate that. On behalf of all women, I appreciate that.

LEWIS HOWES: Yeah, of course. And I wanted to ask you first about suffering. Because it seems like, to me, more and more in the last five years specifically, people had been suffering internally, and it’s caused a lot of external damage in their relationships, their families, to their physical health, the war in communities, and the war in the world. Do you feel like people are suffering more now for specific reasons? Or has this always been happening for forever?

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Absolutely, they’re suffering more now.

LEWIS HOWES: Why more now?

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Because of bad public policy, particularly economic. You have millions of American people who are living with chronic economic anxiety. You have a situation where 1% of Americans own world wealth than the bottom 90%. There are millions of people who live with the chronic concern: “What will happen if I get sick?” “What will happen if one of my kids get sick?” “How will I send my children to college?” “How am I ever going to pay off these college loans?” This kind of pressure, that kind of economic pressure day in and day out that sort of has you trapped is debilitating. It is emotionally and psychologically debilitating.

Now people who have careers like mine base our work on the effort to be of use and of help to people who are suffering. But I heard a story once that very much reminds me of how I see my own journey, and it’s a story that if I were to title it, I would call “The Transition To The Conscious Samaritan.” So we all know the story of the Good Samaritan. The Good Samaritan walks down the road, sees a beggar, and gives them alms. And then the Good Samaritan continues down the road, sees another beggar, and gives that beggar alms. And then the Good Samaritan continues down the road and sees another beggar and gives that beggar alms. At a certain point, the Good Samaritan says to himself, “Why are there so many beggars?” That’s the conscious samaritan. 

So in my life and in my career, I understand things happen. People die, divorces happen, all kinds of personal crises occur. And I understand that the transcendence of that suffering is an inside job. But what I have seen, particular in the last 15 or 20 years is how much of that suffering, that anxiety, that tension, that depression is because of very unnecessary circumstances of hardship given that we are the richest country in the world. I’ve realized that people who are spiritual facilitators, coaches, psychotherapists shouldn’t be constantly picking up the mess created by a political system that does more to advocate for short-term profits of huge multinational corporations than to advocate for the health and wellbeing and safety of us, the people of the planet, and the planet itself on which we live.

When you have millions of American children going to school everyday in classrooms that don’t even have adequate school supplies to teach a child to read … and if a child cannot learn to read by the age of 8, the chances of high school graduation are drastically diminished, then the chances of incarceration are drastically increased. I’m working to help assuage the pain of the mother of that child, but it’s public policy that is determining the fact that millions of American children in the richest country In the world go to classrooms [inaudible] glue sticks and paper. We have children in America who are on suicide watch in elementary schools. We have millions of American children who ask their elementary school teachers whether they have some food for them today.

What I just described here would be human suffering that could not be helped if we were living in other countries. This is the richest country in the world. So that is an example of huge swathes of suffering that occurs in this country for no other reason than bad public policy that is so skewered towards those who already have and [inaudible] who do not. 

LEWIS HOWES: [inaudible]?

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Absolutely unnecessary.

LEWIS HOWES: We have this much money, kids should not be suffering—

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Thank you, thank you. 

LEWIS HOWES: Yeah. When other countries have less money and their kids are safe and they feel like they—

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Yeah, we have plenty of money. We’re just giving it to a top [inaudible]. Many of the individuals in that top [inaudible] would agree with everything we’re saying here, by the way. Not every rich person is greedy, not every poor person is noble and pure. It’s not the people who are rotten here, it’s the systems that are rotten. And they will not be changed unless we, the people, step in.

LEWIS HOWES: Is it systems or government or policies’ responsibility to support the youth or is it the parents’ responsibility to take ownership of their life and get a better job and educate the kid, you know.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Well, that’s real easy for you and me to say.

LEWIS HOWES: Right, right. But I was saying, whose responsibility—

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Well, again, that’s real easy for you and me to say. First, the answer has to do with whether or not we believe in the mission statement of the United States—and I’m sure that you are big on mission statements—as articulated in the Declaration of Independence. So this is what the Declaration of Independence says.

#1. All men are created equal.

#2. God gave all men the unalienable rights of life and of liberty and the pursuit of happiness. 

#3. Governments are instituted to secure those rights. And if government is not doing it, so the Declaration of Independence, it is the right of the people to alter or abolish it.

Now I’m not saying we should abolish it, but alter it to be—yes. So let’s look at those millions of American children. They’re full-on citizens of the United States.

LEWIS HOWES: But they don’t have rights to vote, or…

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: But they do, constitutionally. They don’t have the right to vote because they’re not 18. But they have all the rights of citizenship meaning that their right to pursue happiness, it is the job of the government, as stated in the Declaration of Independence, to secure their right to happiness. So there’s an eight-year-old child trapped in a school where there’s not even adequate school supplies to teach a child to read where statistically, that child is more [inaudible] probability vector to prison than to a job someday. Many of these American children, citizens of the United States, living in what’s called “domestic war zones” where the PTSD of a returning veteran from Afghanistan or Iraq is no more severe than the PTSD of these children. These children just need to get their act together.

And can we talk about how much racial, for instance, a systemic racial disparity in the criminal justice system has more often their mommies or daddies not only taken away to prison than if they weren’t living in a white neighborhood but the statistical probability that those children lived through the trauma of a raid where the police came into the house, took mommy, took daddy, and there was no mental health service by which the kids were ever checked up on. Which is why we have elementary school children who are already in trauma, some of these kids before they even go to preschool. So for us to sit here in our nice white bread, you and I have won from the economic and social system as it now exists. This system is beautiful. If you win within it, you and I both know, there’s no place better to be.

What I’m saying to you, is not that it’s not wonderful within this club. What I’m saying to you is not enough people can get into the club. And there are too many people. And you and I both have careers where we know what it’s like to say to a person: “You need to get your act together.” “You need to stop playing victim.” “You need to go get a job.” “You need to atone for your mistakes.” “You need to take responsibility for your character defects.” I know from that, you know from that. But there are a lot of people—trust me, Lewis—for whom, they’re trapped in a way you should not be trapped in the United States of America. They need more than internal change. They deserve, as citizens of this country, some external changes. Change is necessary because of how much economic, social, and political policy had been rigged against [inaudible].

So it’s both/and. It’s just like with integrative medicine. You eat both/and. You need to cultivate health, you need to exercise, you need to take care of your health, you need to take care of your lifestyle, you need to take care of your nutrition, and sometimes, you need to take the medicine. It’s both/and, it’s not either/or.

LEWIS HOWES: Yeah, because I believe that we need to change external environments from people but if we give external environments from people that don’t use it to their advantage…

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: And then they [inaudible] accountable. 

LEWIS HOWES: Let’s give the opportunity at first.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Exactly. I look at it the same way I raise my daughter. I raised her giving her every opportunity I can provide for her to thrive, and within that, I expected a lot. And then she failed after that. So it’s like what Martin Luther King said. It’s one thing to tell people to pick themselves up by their bootstraps, but they have to have boots.

LEWIS HOWES: [inaudible]. How do we teach people to pick themselves up when they have the boots? 

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Well, that’s the work that you and I both do, and the people in professions that [inaudible] both do. But I know for myself, I have taken that journey such as the conscious samaritan where I have over the—and what you said at the beginning of our conversation was true. This changed. Remember, I’ve been doing what I do for 35 years. Things changed over the last 15-20 years.  

LEWIS HOWES: Why is that?

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Why is it? Because starting in the 1980s, trickle down economics was proferred to this culture back by a lot of money and a lot of power that said, “If we make the American corporation only responsible on a fiduciary level to its stockholders…”

LEWIS HOWES: To people. 

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: No. Stockholders. There’s a difference between your stockholders and your stakeholders. Your stockholders are stakeholders, but stakeholders are also the workers, the environment, the community. At a certain point, everybody is a stakeholder in what happens in corporate America because the power is so ubiquitous. So starting in the 80s, the trickle down economic theory was get the government out, forget financial regulation, forget safety regulation, forget health regulation, get the government off the back so that these people can create jobs because that’s what we were told. That if you just make these stockholders so rich…

LEWIS HOWES: It’s going to trickle down.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: It’s going to trickle down. And it’s going to lift all boats. Well, it’s been 40 years. I think after 40 years, your jury is in. It not only has not lifted all boats, it has left millions of people without even a life vest. It has created the greatest economic wealth and equality since 1929. It has led us to a situation where 1% of Americans own more wealth than the bottom 90%. So that 40% of all Americans live with a daily struggle to make basic ends meet. You and I don’t live with the basic struggle just to make ends meet so it’s almost like we have to open our hearts to the level of empathy and then ask all this stuff that we tell people about “change your attitude.” If you are on a daily basis [inaudible]. It’s chronic economic trauma. 

LEWIS HOWES: Everyday, fight or flight, there’s no relaxation, you’re in stress mode, constantly in your mind and in your heart, it’s palpitating all the time…

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Thank you, that’s exactly what I was saying. Thank you. That connection. So public policy should unleash the spirit, public policy should uncap people’s dreams, not limit people’s dreams. And then let people soar. You and I know they will because you and I believe. And then you better [inaudible] get your attitude together. 

LEWIS HOWES: Now the opportunity now is up to you.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: But millions and millions and millions of Americans are living on a level of survival that is absolutely unnecessary and a product of amoral economic system that has corrupted our government and hijacked America’s value system.

LEWIS HOWES: Yeah. What do you think is the root of emotional disconnection for people right now? Why are people so disconnected emotionally? 

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Fear. When you live in survival, when you live in that, you’re so afraid. 

LEWIS HOWES: You can’t connect.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Right. If I have a process through my trauma and my pain and suffering, I’m not capable of being present [inaudible].

LEWIS HOWES: Or having compassion or empathy for someone else.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Which is what that would mean. People, see, they’re just trying to—

LEWIS HOWES: Survive. 

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: You’ve got millions and millions and millions of people in the richest country in the world just trying to survive while a tiny, tiny, tiny group of people think about where the second or third private jet’s going to come from. Now that’s not just a product of those people got their act together and their attitudes together, Lewis. That’s a product of some economic injustice. Now, you and I—I’m looking at your wall. A lot of the people who have made it in addition to getting their attitude together, they’re very talented people. Some of them geniuses. 

LEWIS HOWES: They have skill sets, they have talents.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Yeah, and talents. But that’s not social justice. You shouldn’t have to be like—some people would say, “Oh, we have racial justice in America. Look at Tyler Perry, look at Oprah Winfrey, look at Magic Johnson.” You shouldn’t have to be a genius…

LEWIS HOWES: Or the most talented person in the world.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: That’s kind of the point.


MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: And that’s what aristocracy is. That’s what elitism is. So it’s not enough to just say, “Oh, but look how racially diverse the elite are now.” No, no, no. The point is that in America, we don’t do the “elite get all the good stuff.” That’s what we repudiated in 1776, and we need to repudiate it again. It’s an ongoing struggle, though. You can’t say, “I was healthy in 1997 so I don’t have to take care of my health anymore.” “My marriage was good three years ago so I don’t have to tend to it now.” “My business was doing really good last year so I don’t have to tend to it this year.” Democracy is the same. We have to tend to this every year.

LEWIS HOWES: Everyday.


LEWIS HOWES: If you don’t tend your relationship everyday—

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Don’t go being surprised that you’re losing it.

LEWIS HOWES: Said they would help. If I’m eating pizza and candy all day for—maybe I can do that for a couple of days, but if I do that for months and years, I’m going to have some chronic illness. 

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: And all the patterns of nature mimic themselves on every level. So the same is true true about democracy. What is happening today and what is represented by the agenda of “Him Who Shall Not Be Named” is an opportunistic infection. It couldn’t have happened had there not been a societally weakened immune system. And that societally weakened immune system was a lot of us. And one of the reasons our sense of responsibility politically was weakened was because we were having such a good time succeeding. We were busy. Look at a country like China. You can get very rich in China, you just can’t be free in China. So that’s what the United States has to ask ourself. 

LEWIS HOWES: For the people that don’t have…let’s stay opportunities readily available to them but are in constant trauma and emotional disconnection, and maybe that’s going to take some time for these opportunities to unfold. That are more equal opportunities.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Well, that depends on who your president is.

LEWIS HOWES: Right. Well, it’s going to take at least a year, right?


LEWIS HOWES: It will take a year. So what can they do now before these opportunities unfold to them? 

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: What they can do is go to, give at least $1, and do everything you can to help me get elected, that’s what you can do. Because I want a massive infusion of economic hope and opportunity into the [inaudible] of American civilization. As soon as possible, we want the American people—because all the ways that you described the person living that way, I want an audible sigh of [exhales]. “I don’t have to worry today.” That’s why you have universal health care. That’s why you appealed to 2018 $2 trillion tax cut that gave $.83 of every $1 to the richest among us. You put back in the middle class tax cuts, you make free state colleges and universities, college for all you, you at least raise the minimum wage to at least $15, and you remove these college loan debt which we could do—it would cost less money than that text [inaudible]. And there will be an audible sigh. “Now, I can breathe.” 

LEWIS HOWES: I can imagine.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: And then people can get about living their dreams. Then people can get about starting a website they want, producing what they want, creating what they want. That’s the American dream is that everybody should be able to soar. But Lewis, could you and I do what we’re doing right now if either one of us or—

LEWIS HOWES: No, it would be very challenging. In fact, the moments where I am in that space, I’m running out like a 2 or 3 out of 10. How am I even productive in my life?


LEWIS HOWES: Yeah, of course. But for the people that it’s going to take a year, a couple of years till things get moving, what do people do now? Because if they’re facing trauma, constantly chronic, emotional, mental, physical—whatever it may be, how can they ease a little bit of the pain emotionally and internally so they can try to take those steps? 

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Well, I feel that the ultimate answers come from within. From the realization that we’re part of a higher power. That love is who we are, that in the space of love, miracles occur naturally. To ask who have I not forgiven, to atone for our own mistakes, to make amends for the places where we have not been the people that we should be, to do that inner work. But when we do that inner work, I don’t think that that mimics us complacent about the societal conditions that cause so much unnecessary suffering. I think that that part of what releases us—I think we need to claim citizenship as an aspect of a well-lived life. That’s all. 

And I think that there is an awakening in this country today. The country’s traumatized right now. And for those who believe that we are in a chapter that needs to end—for those who do—and I’m sure some people listening are Trump supporters—hey, it’s America. Everybody has that right. But for those who are listening who are not Trump supporters and do not wish to see the president get a second term, then get busy right now. This is going to be intense.

LEWIS HOWES: I can’t even watch news because it just triggers so much trauma. Even if it’s for 10 seconds, just reading a headline, watching news, seeing this clip happen. For me, it’s really hard. I don’t watch news.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: I don’t know about your personal stuff or [inaudible], are you married? 

LEWIS HOWES: Not married, no.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Do you have children?

LEWIS HOWES: No children.


LEWIS HOWES: I got a girlfriend.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Okay. Let’s see that with your girlfriend. Let’s say that—God forbid—[besides?] he knows I’m sick. Wouldn’t you say, I’m going, “What are you talking about?” She said, “Well, we got some bad news, and I’m going to the doctor on Thursday.” Wouldn’t you say “I’m going with you”?

LEWIS HOWES: Yeah, of course.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Would you say: “I just can’t listen to what the doctor has to say because it would trigger me.” No, that’s not what a man does. You’d be there. You’d be listening to everything he says because you love her. And you would need to know everything he’s telling you about what’s wrong. You don’t go to the doctor to heal you and expect the doctor not to give you the bad news.

LEWIS HOWES: Right. He’d give you the bad news. 

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: That’s by definition, otherwise they can’t heal you. So politics is the same. If you don’t know what’s wrong, if you don’t look at the problem, you can’t be part of the problem…

LEWIS HOWES: So you’re saying I should be watching news. Being aware of the problems—

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: You should be aware. Yeah, I don’t know if that has to do with TV news—

LEWIS HOWES: Someone could give me a debrief every week of “here’s what’s happening.”

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Well, I kind of do. That’s exactly what I’m doing. And of course in America, there’s a line where it says, “Look at the crucifixion but do not dwell on it.” If you dwell on the bad news, you do expand it. Some people say, “Don’t look at that stuff because what you look at, expands.” But some things expand because you did not look at it such as stage 1 cancer. 

LEWIS HOWES: You need to be aware of things.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: There are plenty of very intelligent news sources. Let’s say you do something like the daily report from NPR. Something that not sensationalize it and—

LEWIS HOWES: That’s neutral. Yeah.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Well, and very intelligent. And you check it out everyday. Let’s do civic responsibility. And I think particularly as someone who’s successful in America. 

LEWIS HOWES: Okay, I’m going to check it out. I’ll check it out once a week to start.


LEWIS HOWES: Everyday?

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: You got two women in the room, one of them is a woman of color. I can’t speak for her, but I can speak for myself. Everyday. 

LEWIS HOWES: What would that do for me if I listen to it?

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Make you a more intelligent participant in what’s happening in this country at a time of deep peril and crisis.

LEWIS HOWES: Okay, and beyond. Apple News?


LEWIS HOWES: Something.


LEWIS HOWES: Listen and update everyday on something that’s happening.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Yeah. I would go more for NPR. Because that’s where [inaudible]. You know, political media, industrial—

LEWIS HOWES: Gotcha, gotcha. You did the campaign, was it four years ago, three years ago? The Congress campaign?

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Yeah, well I think 14. 

LEWIS HOWES: Five years ago. What made you want to jump to the next level and run for what you’re doing now?

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: After I ran for Congress, I thought, “Well, that was that.” I scratched whatever itch I had because I have had an itch. Did that, that door’s closed, therefore it never occurred to me that there would be more doors beyond that because that door was closed. And when people would ask me, “Would you do it again?” I would say, “No.” I read a book by Ray Dalio, you might have read his principles. 

LEWIS HOWES: Yeah, I haven’t read the whole thing yet, but I— 

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Really? The part I’ve read is good. And he says in there that if you’re going to live a meaningful life, you’re going to take risks, and if you take risks, you’re going to fail sometimes. But if you fail, fail well. That meant so much to me. “Fail well.”

LEWIS HOWES: How do you “fail well”? 

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: You take responsibility for your part on the failure, you don’t carry any bitterness or victim, and you know that the only real failure in life is failure to learn from an experience. I hope that I failed well. You know, people look at you. If you have a public life of any kind, people watch how you experience things. They don’t just watch what you do, they also watch how you respond to what happens to you.

LEWIS HOWES: The bad situations. Failures.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: And people, I noticed, people were so kind, People were so kind to me when I won, and people were so kind to me when I lost. I would be walking down the street, people just say, “I voted for you.” People would be so kind. But I think people were kind of looking sideways, it’s natural [how is she doing?]. I think if they had seen me—you know, they did this to me or anything, people would not have had as much respect. I think people ca respect you—you tried something, you failed at it—that you went for it. And like I said, you feel well. So I think life is not about never falling down, it’s about getting up when you do. I thought that particular path of politics always—

LEWIS HOWES: [inaudible].

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: But for me and for millions of people, the election of Donald Trump changed everything. There are millions of us who are registering not only that this is a crisis in our country but that top on our list of priority should be showing up for whatever way we could possibly make a difference. Because that is what is going to change this. The president is not just a politician, he is a phenomenon.

LEWIS HOWES: In what way?

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: What he has harnessed. He has harnessed racism, he has harnessed bigotry, he has harnessed fear, he has harnessed homophobia—this is a very serious but very…

LEWIS HOWES: He’s a powerful…

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Powerful. People say he’s inept. I go, “Where do you get that he’s inept?” 

LEWIS HOWES: He’s very smart.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: And something’s going on here that I don’t believe traditional political strategy even knows how to deal with. The traditional political establishment—and a lot of people on the Democratic side lack the psychological and emotional perspicacity that is necessary to override this which is why—

LEWIS HOWES: Just to handle it.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: That’s right. Which is why I should be the candidate. 

LEWIS HOWES: The emotional and psychological breakdown of a human psyche.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: That’s right. And he dismantles reason. I know some very good people who support him. And I know how good they are. He dismantles something in a way that has been historically proven to be extremely dangerous. So the only way to override that will be creating an equally powerful phenomenon. And that will be among the American people as [inaudible] of us rise up to harness the only power greater than hate. The only power greater than hate is love. Where there is light, there cannot be darkness, and where there is love there cannot be fear. Many more people in this country love than hate. But hatred now, people who hate, hate with conviction. 

LEWIS HOWES: So much stronger.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: That’s right. So conviction is a force multiplier. If hate is shouting, love cannot afford to just whisper. So we have to become as convicted behind our love as some people are now convicted behind their hate. That can’t just be a love for our own children, it has to be love for the children on the other side of town. We have to become as fierce about children at the border. We have to become fierce about children in neighborhoods where they don’t even have glue sticks and paper in the classroom. As much as we would be if those children were our own.

I read an interview where Jared Kushner said he was sitting with his father-in-law in whatever year it was and said, “There are a lot of angry people out there. We could harness all that and make you president.” The way I look at it, there’s so many loving, good people out there. We could harness all that and change the world. 

LEWIS HOWES: Wow. I just got chills. I like that. What’s the—maybe you’re just starting to say it a little bit—what’s the quote that…

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Nelson Mandela did not write?

LEWIS HOWES: Yeah. Stole yours, yeah.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: No, he didn’t steal it because he didn’t know. He would never [say it?]. He never even used it. It is an urban myth that he even quoted it. There is no speech of his, and including his inaugural address—it’s a total urban myth. I mean I would be bragging about it.

LEWIS HOWES: So he never used it?

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: No. His office says there’s absolutely no…

LW: But there’s just [inaudible] by him that go—


LEWIS HOWES: What is the quote?

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: It’s a paragraph from my book Return To Love that says, “Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate, our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure.”  We ask ourselves “Who am I?” to be talented, gorgeous, fabulous—which I love, by the way. I have to say something for that. “Who am I to be talented, gorgeous, brilliant, and fabulous?” That is not something a man who has spent 25 years in a South African prison would be saying. It is so clearly a girl talking. “Who am I to be fabulous? Who am I to be…” I mean, hello! Hello!

LEWIS HOWES: Amazing. I love that quote. So many people use that.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Thank you. I always say about that book, “If you liked the paragraph, you’ll love the book.” 

LEWIS HOWES: Go buy it. 

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: I watch people, you know, they’ll buy the paragraph on some fancy calligraphy, and I’ll think, “You just spent more money on the paragraph then you would have spent buying the book.” There’s so many paragraphs in the book. 

LEWIS HOWES: That’s amazing. I’m curious, you in an intimate relationship currently?


LEWIS HOWES: No. Has there anyone who’s ever won the presidency who was not in a “intimate, committed relationship” that you’re aware of?

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: I think there were a couple. I think there were a couple of widowers who got married in the White House. Now, Adlai Stevenson was single and a lot of people thought the fact that he was single was one of the reasons he didn’t win. But I think at that time, it was a different time. I think there was a lot of questioning about what his sexuality was.

LEWIS HOWES: When was this, what year?


LEWIS HOWES: Okay, gotcha. So do you think that—I mean, you’ve got a lot of hatred. There’s a lot of criticism for every politician. Not just you, but every politician faces a lot of support and a lot of these online bullying attacks. I can only imagine what happens right at this level, the attacks online. Tell me if I’m wrong here but I feel like you’re probably getting a lot of love and a lot of hatred or attack. 

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: I get a lot of  derision.

LEWIS HOWES: What’s that?


LEWIS HOWES: Okay, mockery. Got you. So making fun of…just like they do with Trump.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Yeah, especially after that debate.

LEWIS HOWES: Right, right.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: But then, those memes were hilarious.

LEWIS HOWES: [inaudible], yeah, it’s great. And its attention.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Yeah, and it’s really interesting. The whole meme about—I’ve gone from ironic to unironic support of Marianne Williamson. They talk about this recovery. I’m in recovery from addiction to establishment politics, somebody say, stage one. “I thought she was out on the debate, but still—” One article in the New York Times talked about my performance at the debate. It said, “She was weird and weirdly compelling.”

LEWIS HOWES: Interesting. That’s good.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: A weird but weirdly compelling performance. “The [US’?] number one. She was odd, but was interesting to watch. Number two, ‘Well, actually, what she said, I agree with.’ Number three, ‘Well, I’m ironically in support of her.’ Number four,” God, I mean, you really realize.

LEWIS HOWES: You know, it’s interesting. A great branding expert, Sally Hogshead, said that different is better than better. So don’t try to be better than everyone else, but be different because that’s going to stand out as a one of a kind person that people will pay more attention to.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: That’s interesting because it’s aligned with something I’ve said to somebody. I’ve said, “I think if I’d performed better at the debates, I wouldn’t have gotten as much attention.”

LEWIS HOWES: Interesting.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: It was my—the fact that scared and not knowing how to get it out there. 

LEWIS HOWES: Uniqueness. It was the uniqueness. I think that’s—

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Hopefully in the next debate, I will be—

LEWIS HOWES: I watched that day, I thought you were great. To get back to the question and my thought. So you’re not in an intimate relationship, or at least not a public one. And you were married briefly. Isn’t that right?

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Oh, no. My marriage was like the best weekend I ever had. That was many, many years ago.

LEWIS HOWES: A long time ago.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: That was not really a marriage.

LEWIS HOWES: Yeah, it was like a quick thing. You ever married since?


LEWIS HOWES: Do you feel like with all the attention and energy and touring and…it’s just going to be non-stop. Do you feel like you have an advantage by being I guess, single or not [inaudible] relationship or?

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: To be honest, I have a very, a very different perspective on that that I’ve had throughout my career.

LEWIS HOWES: What’s that?

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Throughout my career, I have seen intimate relationships as certainly wonderful. But I couldn’t imagine being married and having the career I had. With this, it’s kind of different, it’s the opposite. It’s a really hard thing to do. Unlike the rest of my career, it’s a hard thing to do without that.

LEWIS HOWES: Really? Wow, how does that make you feel?

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: You’re surrounded by way too many people on the payroll.


MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: You’re surrounded by way too many people on the payroll. So…

LEWIS HOWES: So you’re getting the emotional support you need, or someone telling you the real truth about—

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Yeah, I have all that.

LEWIS HOWES: And just a place to go back and be safe and relax.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Yeah. I look at Barack and Michelle, and Bush had Laura. And Clinton, whatever you think about them, they have each other. They do. On the level of deep, deep subconnection. You look at Jimmy Carter and Rosalynn. And I look back now and I realize I’m not surprised that so many of the presidents in our history, in our lifetime, they had serious partners, because this is a tough job to hold alone. It is a tough job to hold alone. But it also wouldn’t be every man’s cup of tea, would it?

LEWIS HOWES: Do you feel like a woman is better suited to do it alone as opposed to a man?


LEWIS HOWES: I’m just generalizing this, but—

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: God, I can’t speak to that. I don’t know. But one of the other candidates was talking about her husband the other day.  We were in the car and he had all these ideas and blah blah blah, and I could feel like, “I wish I had that.”

LEWIS HOWES: So do you have someone, at least like a good friend or someone—

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Well, yeah. I mean, I have people in my life, certainly, that are close friends that I talk to. But I think, you would ask specifically about marriage and intimate relationships. It’s interesting for me, though. I thought a lot about it when I was—I really processed this decision for a year and a half whether not to run.

LEWIS HOWES: Oh, okay, got you.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: And that was one of the phases I went through. It’s, “Well, how can I do this alone?” But it particularly surprised me because I’ve been the exact opposite on that for my 35-year career. It was like, “I cannot do that, you cannot ask that much of me. You cannot ask that much of me.”

LEWIS HOWES: You’re on a mission to do this, you don’t have the time and attention.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Yeah, and I can’t even put it together in my head why it’s different.

LEWIS HOWES: Is it you feel like it’s just a bigger weight?

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Well, no. You know what it is? It’s not a bigger weight, but it’s my career up until this point is as solid. It’s me and of course, the miracles and my spiritual connection that I’m carrying this with. It’s very different. This is worldly, in a way.

LEWIS HOWES: Wasn’t that worldly, too?

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: But the worldly part, I didn’t need. The worldly part, intimate relationship for the last 35 years, has been the antidote to the worldly stress. It’s normal, it’s what you do for fun and relaxation. But I didn’t need a partner to carry the career with me. I didn’t need that. I was carrying the career fine, thank you. I needed something else. This is different. It’s…

LEWIS HOWES: So does that mean you’re open to a relationship?

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: I’m sort of thinking now. We’re doing this on a podcast, I’m not so sure…

LEWIS HOWES: Yeah, I asked you if there’s anything off-limits.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: I know. It didn’t occur to me we would be doing this.

LEWIS HOWES: I’m just curious. I feel like this is the stuff that is most fascinating to me. This type of conversation, but—

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: I see love as a great mystery. And I see my history with love as a mystery. I think a lot of people feel that way.

LEWIS HOWES: Love as the concept or intimate partnership?

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Intimate partnership.

LEWIS HOWES: Yeah, yeah. It’s a mystery.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Intimate partnership. I think that there is no doubt that the path for a woman is different than the path for a man. Definitely. And the kind of man that I’ve been with don’t want to go around holding Marianne’s purse.

LEWIS HOWES: Right. Interesting.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: I mean, I’ve looked even in this, even in this race, looking at other candidates. The women, I don’t see their husbands walking around just carrying their purse, don’t get me wrong. But the men that I’ve been with in my life, where I was with relationships in terms of my career fit. It fit. So I did not walk into this experience with someone at my side on that level. That would be a miracle that I can imagine somebody walking into this and going—

LEWIS HOWES: If you’re watching and listening and you’re up for this, hey, of course [inaudible] miracles [inaudible].


LEWIS HOWES: Whatever it takes, right, to heal humanity? And that might be something—


LEWIS HOWES: Whatever it takes to heal humanity.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Well, somebody said to me, I was in some interview and they said, “You will be the first single person,” or something. I said, “We have until January 2020, 2021.” So let’s just be open here.

LEWIS HOWES: Wow. What would it take for you, what type of partner would be the miracle? The characteristics or the values or the leadership? What type of person would that be that you’d say, “I’d be open to going down this journey with you.”

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: It’s never that, is it? It’s your inner knowing.

LEWIS HOWES: Wow. Isn’t that the truth? Woah. [inaudible] juicy there, I like this. What’s your greatest fear then, moving into the next year? It’s a monumental, big thing right?

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: My greatest fear: embarrassment, humiliation, feeling I made a fool of myself.

LEWIS HOWES: What’s the worst that could happen? You make a fool of yourself, you embarrass yourself, and then what?

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: That’s a big deal.



LEWIS HOWES: By going forward, though?

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: No, this is a bigger deal than that. Remember, I’m running for president. And so far, even though there are those who mock me, even though there are those who seek to humiliate me, even though there’s those who derive me, it’s a critical mass of people who hear what I’m saying. When I’m out in this primary states campaigning, my words are landing. But I know how vicious this particular world can get. And so I never know what’s coming. Two things that somebody told me, my friend, Bobby Roth, who’s head of the David Lynch Foundation—he’d be a good person for you to interview. He’s fascinating.


MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: He said two things. Maharishi Mahesh Yogi said, “See the job, do the job, stay out of the misery.” That one’s helpful to me. And he also said that the Bhagavad Gita has a quote, “You are responsible for your actions. You are not responsible for their results.” And I read a book somewhere, a long time ago which said something that meant so much to me. It said, “To be fully invested in an effort and unattached to the result.” So that’s what I’m seeking to be. Fully invested in the effort and unattached to the result.

I feel like I would be the best person to be president of the United States going forward because I believe that we need a fundamental pattern disruption of the economic, social, and political status quo in the United States. We need a moral revival. We need a political visionary. We need someone who knows how to harness imagination and inspiration. We need someone who has no moral equivocation whatsoever. We need someone who has not been connected to the political establishment that drove us into this ditch. I challenge the idea that only those who had been are qualified to lead us out of the dead. I challenge this whole notion of a political class. It’s like a Wizard of Oz, like something’s going on there that we don’t know, like they have some special powers.

Some people might say, “Yeah. It has to do with knowing administrative aspects of the job.” But President Roosevelt said that moral leadership is the most important part of the presidency, not the administrative aspect. And you can have the best political expert in the world, you can have the best car mechanic in the world, but the car mechanic doesn’t necessarily know what road you should take to Milwaukee. And I think the 21st century demands an integrative mindset that you don’t find within the political establishment. We need a psychological and an emotional perspicacity in order to really understand the underlying forces at work in creating societal dysfunction and in creating societal repair.

And that’s what I’ve been dealing with for the last 35 years. Because the same psychological and emotional forces that prevail within the journey of one individual prevail within the journey of a nation. So I believe that in my heart, and I believe that other people believe that, too. I also know the tremendous resistance of the political media, industrial complex, the political status quo and of course, the status quo seeks to perpetuate itself. So they’re going to project onto me that I’m wacky and amateur. I read one article saying I’m an amateur. No they’re an amateur at what I do. And what I do is what I believe is necessary in order to forge the 21st century that is even survivable.

When I say things like, “I believe that all public policy should be guided by love.” So people say, “Well, what’s the politics of love?” Well, it’s not mysterious. You see a hungry child, you feed that child. You see an uneducated child, you educate that child. You see a poor person who is struggling through no fault of their own, you help them. And you see all these incipient conflicts in the world, and you wage peace. That is what should drive all domestic and international policy. Right now, our domestic and international policy is driven by short-term profit maximization for health insurance companies and big pharmaceutical companies and fossil fuel companies and chemical companies and gun manufacturers and defense contractors.

Now, there are people who say that I’m naive to say, “No, government should help people thrive.” That’s what government should be for. Because once people thrive, they create their own peace and prosperity. Some people say that I’m naive to say, “A politics of love is the only antidote to a politics of fear.” I say that what’s naive is to think that if we do not make that change, we will even survive on this planet for another hundred years.

LEWIS HOWES: I’ve got three final questions in here.


LEWIS HOWES: Short on time here. With the weight of this that’s coming to you, and you have already been feeling the weight and the pressure, but then the weight that’s coming. How do you train your heart every morning to prepare yourself for all the good that’s coming and all the praise and celebration and acknowledgement, but also the crazy, emotional reactions, attacks, whatever you want to call them?

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Well, also that is exacerbated by the fact that everybody has a cellphone now.

LEWIS HOWES: And anything could be shared and said. Anyone could say whatever they want.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: I made one lazy, not as clear as I should have been, comment about vaccines.

LEWIS HOWES: Yeah, now everyone’s holding onto that and spreading it [inaudible].
MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: You can say one thing that, “Oh, I should’ve said that better.”
LEWIS HOWES: But hasn’t Trump said lots of things that he just moves on and he just deflects and deflects?

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: He said, as we all know, “I could murder someone on 5th Avenue and not be held accountable for that.” We should’ve known then who’s talking.

LEWIS HOWES: Wow. So how do you prepare yourself for…on a daily basis?

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: When I was deciding whether or not to run, part of my process was praying that God would give me a tougher skin.

LEWIS HOWES: Right, because everyone needs that, right? 

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: That’s number one. Number two, meditating in the morning. The Course in Miracle says five minutes in the morning guarantees that love will be in charge of your thought forms throughout the day. And I pray to be an instrument of love, and I’m not a perfect person, I’m not an enlightened master. I’m not saying that 24/7, I’m always on that wagon, but the chances of my making a dumb mistake are drastically reduced.

LEWIS HOWES: Through meditation in the morning, yeah.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: And there is a level of not just intellectual discipline, but emotional discipline that [inaudible] in this. There are people—

LEWIS HOWES: So much discipline.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: —who have sent money, sometimes very hard-earned money. I remember during the congressional campaign somebody saying, “I’m sending $10. And when I get paid next week, I will send another 10.”


MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: So I am not only spending other people’s money, but I am showing up for something at a very serious time. Just like in my career up to this point, I have known I have a very serious responsibility. People’s psyches are in my hands. I have to work really hard. I feel similar about this. This is serious business. This is very serious business, and people who are supporting you are seeing you as a candidate, having a transformational, more expanded conversation, getting more real, getting deep—this is a tremendous responsibility. So you Marianne, do not get to indulge, you will not indulge any whining today. If I even start, “I’m so tired. They were mean to me.” I just [inaudible]  slap myself and put myself in a cold shower [inaudible] “No, no, no, no. I crossed the Rubicon, I said I was doing this. I am doing this, and people have every right to expect that I’m showing up for this.” By the way, a campaign is a job. It’s an audition. If I can’t handle a campaign, how would I handle the presidency? And people are looking to see who you are and have every right to look to see who you are. And I’m trying my best.

LEWIS HOWES: Yeah. That’s good, that’s great. You’ve got this book, The Politics of Love. You’ve got your website, which talks about how you’ll take action when you’re president. So [inaudible] talk about that here.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Right. In my issue, section, all the policies. You know, there’s this myth out there that I don’t have plans. I have plenty of plants and plenty of policy positions as much as any other candidate out there. More, in some cases.

LEWIS HOWES: And your website has all of the information. I watched a ton of interviews on there, it’s really inspiring stuff.


LEWIS HOWES: This book, I haven’t read yet, but it’s a handbook for a new American revolution, A Politics of Love. All your other books are amazing. So I’m assuming this is incredible. I’m going to dive in, so make sure you guys get this book. I’m going to ask you one final question. Before I do, I want to acknowledge you again like I did in the beginning. Because this takes a lot of courage, and you inspired me by showing me what’s possible at any age, and doing it without a partner.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: [inaudible] doing without a partner.

LEWIS HOWES: An intimate partner, you know what I mean.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: [inaudible] tonight, who knows.

LEWIS HOWES: Yeah. I could [inaudible] a miracle. I just feel like it’s really challenging to get back up after four or five years ago of doing something and not working out and saying, “I’m going to go to a whole another level.” To have the courage to say, “I matter and my heart is telling me to do this,” and not to deny what your heart says. No matter how scary it may be, I think that’s really inspiring.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: On the one hand, I want to thank you for that. And I want to say Americans have such a low bar for what we think courage is. Courage is to be a woman in certain parts of the world who if they set a fraction of what I have said in criticism with my government would be thrown in prison and possibly tortured. And so I feel that every American woman particularly has to remember we’re speaking for thousands of women who could not speak for themselves. We must speak for a survivable future for our children and our grandchildren, who must speak for nature, who must speak for the planet, who must speak for love.

LEWIS HOWES: I understand. It’s a different perspective of courage in your position and your [inaudible]

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: So what are they going to do? They’re going to throw tomatoes at me and say mean things about me in magazines.

LEWIS HOWES: I still think it’s courageous. I don’t understand the perspective

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Thank you. I get it, and I appreciate it.

LEWIS HOWES: Yeah, of course. I think it’s great. Okay, this is the final question. Imagine it’s the last debate before the election and you’ve done everything you can. It’s them, you, and one other person. What would you say if you have 30 to 60 seconds and the whole country has turned on their TVs or radios or whatever it is, ouTube, live, whatever it is, and they get to watch you share your final message of why you should be the president.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: If I made any mistake in that first debate, it’s that it was almost weirdly than I was overprepared in the sense that I had so much information in my head, they had got in the way of just me showing up as me. And in interviews where I just show up as me, I do fine. So I don’t know what I would say, but my desire would be to show up for me. When you vote for president, you cannot know every challenge that will be facing that president, but you’re voting for the consciousness of a person. What would be their basic view, what would be their basic worldview, what would be their basic mindset, what would be the basic way they would approach a problem? Who are they? Because the president is in our face for four years.

That would be my hope. So my hope at the end of this campaign is that I will have truly expressed and articulated not only who I am, but my vision for this country. And then the rest of it is where it belongs, and that is in the hands of the people.

LEWIS HOWES: And not being attached to the result.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: When I’m in those states, like Iowa and New Hampshire and South Carolina and Nevada. Although now California is technically an early primary state, but I don’t get in people’s eyes that they really register what that means yet, that they can start early voting on February 3rd next year. Something very profound is going on there. There are two political universes: one is the dog and pony show and poles and money and all that stuff. The other is what happens when you’re really talking to voters about the things that matter. And that’s a beautiful and a profound place where democracy still works. So if I can end the campaign feeling, I did it, they know who I am—they know who I am, they know what I stand for, and they know what I will do if they give me the job, then I will be satisfied that whatever decision they make, as long as we get to count the votes and all of that stuff, I [inaudible] to the will of the people, and that’s how it should be, and that’s just how I hope it unfolds.

LEWIS HOWES: If you’re inspired, you can donate at the donate button there, you can watch videos, get the book. This is for your campaign if they get the book?
MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: No, that doesn’t.

LEWIS HOWES: It doesn’t. But it helps them learn more about everything.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Absolutely, absolutely. And social media…

LEWIS HOWES: Everything. Mariannewilliamson2020 or is it @mariannewilliamson on Instagram?

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Any of them will get there, but marianne2020.

LEWIS HOWES: Cool. Awesome. Marianne, thank you so much.


LEWIS HOWES: I appreciate it. I appreciate you.

MARIANNE WILLIAMSON: Thank you, thank you.


LEWIS HOWES: Wow, wow, wow. I hope you enjoyed this episode. Powerful insights, powerful wisdom. Loved everything Marianne had to say and loved her vulnerability. If you loved her vulnerability as well, then let me know and let her know @lewishowes, @mariannewilliamson over on Instagram. I’m sure she’d love to hear from you. And share this with one friend. You can inspire someone by being a giver today by just copying the link on the Podcast app on Apple or on Spotify or Just send the link to one friend today and say, “Hey, check this out. I really think you’re going to enjoy this.” Be a hero, be a champion in someone’s life and share it out. Post it on your social media, all over the place if you can as well, if you’re inspired, too. And just tag me so I can connect with you and know who you are. I’d love to get to know you better.

If this is your first time here, please click the subscribe button on Apple podcast right now. Subscribe and leave a rating and review. I don’t care if you leave me a one star or a five star, I would just love to hear from you. Hear what you thought about this. So write a couple sentences, write a thought, write a word. It doesn’t matter to me. I want to connect with you, I want to hear from you, I want to find ways to improve and grow and impact your life the best way possible. This podcast started out for me to learn, and everytime I interview someone, I learn so much and I try to apply as much as I can to my own life and hope you’re applying this to your life as well. So please let me know over on Apple podcast, click subscribe, rate, and review.

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You were born for something great in your life. You were born to discover your unique gifts and to share those talents with the world. You have a light that shines within you, and I believe it’s our responsibility to shine our light to the people around us. To share our light with others. You also have a darkness inside of you and sometimes, we turn on that darkness too much. Or we turn off our light too much and so our darkness is showing. It’s a choice. Everyday is a choice. You can be dark or you can show lightness. I want you to turn on your light more and more everyday. It takes courage, it takes bravery. It’s a risk, it’s not easy, and it takes a commitment consistently. But your light is what you were born to do, you were born to share it, you were born to give it. You were born to be it. “Your greatest power is to show love, to receive love, and to be loved,” said Oprah Winfrey. And Albert Einstein said, “Peace cannot be kept by force. It can only be achieved by understanding.”

I love you so very much. And as always, you know what time it is. It’s time to go out there and do something great.


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